DH Web-Interface - first impressions

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Cuspis
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:23 pm
Location: Germany

DH Web-Interface - first impressions

Post by Cuspis » Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm

Further down on the page is the text in German. The German text is worded more precisely.
Weiter unten auf der Seite befindet sich der Text in deutscher Sprache. Der deutsche Text ist präziser formuliert.



First of all many thanks to the DH team for the first steps to the web interface, which makes the planning much easier.

I am aware that this is an early stage. That is why I am already now introduce my ideas and considerations so that they can be integrated as soon as possible if required.

Here are my ideas for the DH web interface:

1. The sign-in on Google is quite cumbersome - there is always a security question, because the desktop PC is allegedly unknown.

2. Please show the plan or status name somewhere in the title area (not only in the Cloud Storage menu).

3. With "Save State" the current name of the plan should be suggested (then it can be supplemented more easily with a version number).

4. For the desktop version, the panels on the right and left side of the map could be daintier and smaller in size (more space on the map and the panels do not need to be extra expanded - faster work).

5. Corrections in the number fields should also be saved with "Enter" instead of additionally clicking on "Save" (faster work).

6. If several selected waypoints are deselected by clicking on the map, the display of all waypoints disappears (only the contour of the trajectory is visible). It must be clicked on for further processing, first the contour and then the now to be edited waypoint - a bit awkward.

7. "Set Gimbal" displays partially five-digit numbers. Only when you adjust the slider, the usual degrees appear.

8. In "Set Gimbal", the degree display does not change when "Direct at POI" is requested.

9. The display of "Rotate" always automatically returns to zero after changes.

10. It might be helpful to initiate editing the waypoints by right-clicking.

11. When the 3D-view is selected, it is first cropped sideways - it must first be zoomed out to see the entire trajectory.

12. It would be helpful if in the 3D view the line of sight of the camera is indicated by a line up to the POI (as in the mobile app).

13. It would be a good time now to implement the specification for a specific airspeed between individual waypoints (important, for example, for the approach to the first photo and from the last image to the landing position).

14. I'm just an amateur pilot. But if I had a company and used DH professionally, I would be very worried about storing all the data in the cloud.
I have not found any clues as to whether the transfer of data to the cloud is encrypted end-to-end.
I have not found any clues as to whether the business data is encrypted in the cloud and if it is only viewable by the user.
Rather, the Privacy Policy suggests that all steps of DH users are tracked and logged in detail. That worries me even as a private user!

15. For this reason, you should offer in the program settings to secure the status either locally, encrypted in the cloud or in both places.

16. It is not yet clear how the synchronization between the cloud and the mobile device should take place when e.g. on the mobile device changes are made and no network is available for synchronization. How is the treatment of possible version conflicts?

17. Presumably, a new pdf user guide will be launched soon. It would be helpful if date and version no. could be noted on the title page or in the file name.



--- --- ---



Zunächst einmal vielen Dank an das DH-Team für die ersten Schritte zum Web-Interface, was die Planungen deutlich erleichtert.

Mir ist bewußt, dass es sich dabei um ein frühes Stadium handelt. Deshalb bringe ich meine Ideen und Betrachtungen aber schon jetzt ein, damit sie bei Bedarf rechtzeitig integriert werden können.

Hier meine Ideen zum DH Web-Interface:


1. Das Sign-In über Google ist recht umständlich - es erfolgt immer noch mal eine Sicherheitsabfrage, weil der Desktop-PC angeblich nicht bekannt ist.

2. Bitte irgendwo im Titelbereich die Plan- bzw. Statusbezeichnung anzeigen (nicht nur im Cloud-Storage-Menue).

3. Bei "Save State" sollte der augenblickliche Name des Plans vorgeschlagen werden (kann dann einfacher um eine Versions-Nr. ergänzt werden).

4. Für die Desktop-Version könnten die Bedienfelder rechts und links der Karte zierlicher und mit kleinerer Schrift ausfallen (mehr Platz auf der Karte und die Bedienfelder müssen nicht zusätzlich extra ausgeklappt werden - schnelleres Arbeiten).

5. Korrekturen in den Zahlenfeldern sollten auch mit "Enter" statt mit zusätzlichem Anklicken von "Save" abgespeichert werden (schnelleres Arbeiten).

6. Wenn mehrere selektierte Wegpunkte durch Klick auf die Karte abgewählt werden, verschwindet die Anzeige aller Wegpunkte (nur die Kontour der Flugbahn ist sichtbar). Es muss zur weiteren Bearbeitung erst die Kontour und dann der jetzt zu bearbeitende gewünschte Wegpunkt angeklickt werden - etwas umständlich.

7. Bei "Set Gimbal" werden teilweise fünfstellige Zahlen angezeigt. Erst wenn man den Schieber verstellt, erscheinen die üblichen Gradzahlen.

8. Bei "Set Gimbal" verändert sich die Gradanzeige nicht, wenn "Direct at POI" angefordert wird.

9. Die Anzeige von "Rotate" springt nach Veränderungen immer wieder auf Null zurück.

10. Es könnte hilfreich sein, die Bearbeitung der Wegpunkte auch durch einen Rechtsklick einzuleiten.

11. Wenn die 3D-Ansischt gewählt wird, ist sie zunächst seitlich beschnitten - es muss erst herausgezoomt werden, um die gesamte Flugbahn zu sehen.

12. Es wäre hilfreich, wenn in der 3D-Ansicht die Blickrichtung der Kamera durch eine Linie bis an den POI angezeigt wird (wie in der mobilen App).

13. Es wäre jetzt ein guter Zeitpunkt, die Vorgabe für eine bestimmte Fluggeschwindigkeit zwischen einzelnen Wegpunkten zu implementieren (wichtig z. B. für den Anflug bis zum ersten Foto und vom letzten Bild bis zur Landeposition).

14. Ich bin nur ein Amateurpilot. Wenn ich aber eine Firma hätte und DH professionell einsetzen würde, wäre ich doch sehr besorgt über die Speicherung sämtlicher Daten in der Cloud.
Ich habe keine Hinweise gefunden, ob die Übertragung der Daten in die Cloud Ende-zu-Ende verschlüsselt erfolgt.
Ich habe keine Hinweise gefunden, ob die Business-Daten in der Cloud verschlüsselt und nur vom User selbst einsehbar sind.
Die Privacy Policy lässt vielmehr vermuten, dass alle Schritte der DH-Anwender detailliert verfolgt und geloggt werden. Das macht mir selbst als Privatanwender Sorge!

15. Aus diesem Grunde sollten Sie in den Programm-Settings anbieten, den Status wahlweise lokal, verschlüsselt in der Cloud oder an beiden Orten zu sichern.

16. Es ist noch nicht erkennbar, wie die Synchronisation zwischen Cloud und mobilem Device erfolgen soll, wenn z. B. am Mobilgerät Änderungen vorgenommen werden und kein Netz zur Synchronisation zur Verfügung steht. Wie erfolgt die Behandlung von eventuellen Versionskonflikten?

17. Vermutlich wird bald ein neuer pdf-User-Guide aufgelegt. Es wäre hilfreich, wenn dabei Datum und Versions-Nr. im Titel oder im Dateinamen vermerkt werden könnten.

JasonBSteele
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Apr 28, 2019 6:31 pm

Re: DH Web-Interface - first impressions

Post by JasonBSteele » Sun May 05, 2019 1:56 pm

I'd like to add my own observations to this post rather than starting another.

1. Totally agree with the point about having to use Save to save numbers, and would add that even an "enter" may not be necessary, just changing the number should be enough (after all if you slide a slider it has changed a number immediately).

2. The "hit area" for selecting a way point is very small. I was using a trackpad rather than a mouse but even so you have to be pointing at about one of 4 pixels to select it!

3. I find having to unselect a way point before selecting another one cumbersome, I frequently forget and end up updating both way points instead of one.

4. I would rather use the shift key to select all the way points between the last selected and the current one, and ctrl key to select individual ones. This makes selecting multiple way points easier, especially when we don't have the lasso yet!

5. I would also like to see a line from the way point to the centre of the image it will capture. And the full cone as well is nice, but perhaps it could be more subtle than the mobile app where it looks a bit solid.

6. I would also welcome the ability to set speed between way points.

Thanks

Cuspis
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:23 pm
Location: Germany

Re: DH Web-Interface - first impressions

Post by Cuspis » Mon May 06, 2019 12:58 pm

@JasonBSteele:

en:
The suggestion # 4. is excellent! That would also correspond to my wish.

The suggestion # 1. is a bit dangerous if you change your mind in between and still want to leave everything as it was.
The immediate acceptance of the values does not quite correspond to the usual procedure for the operation of programs. But at least you could still save yourself with the "UNDO" -function.


de:
Den Vorschlag Nr. 4. finde ich hervorragend! Das würde auch meinem Wunsch entsprechen.

Der Vorschlag Nr. 1. ist etwas gefährlich wenn man zwischendurch seine Meinung ändert und doch alles im bisherigen Zustand belassen möchte.
Die sofortige Übernahme der Werte entspricht nicht ganz dem üblichen Verfahren bei der Bedienung von Programmen. Aber immerhin könnte man sich mit der "UNDO"-Funktion noch retten.

JasonBSteele
Posts: 7
Joined: Sun Apr 28, 2019 6:31 pm

Re: DH Web-Interface - first impressions

Post by JasonBSteele » Mon May 06, 2019 6:41 pm

Cuspis wrote:
Mon May 06, 2019 12:58 pm
The suggestion # 1. is a bit dangerous if you change your mind in between and still want to leave everything as it was.
The immediate acceptance of the values does not quite correspond to the usual procedure for the operation of programs. But at least you could still save yourself with the "UNDO" -function.
I would say that the immediate acceptance of values is becoming more common. If you look at Chrome settings for example there are no Save buttons.
If you find yourself entering a value when you didn't intend to the Escape key sometimes works to revert.

Thanks

Martin
Posts: 194
Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:47 pm

Re: DH Web-Interface - first impressions

Post by Martin » Thu May 09, 2019 12:03 pm

First of all, thanks for all the detailed feedback. MUCH appreciated.
We encourage you to use our idea platform, where you can add and vote on new ideas or features: https://ideas.droneharmony.com

Now let's walk through your ideas (many of which I used to add them as feature request in our idea platform).
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
1. The sign-in on Google is quite cumbersome - there is always a security question, because the desktop PC is allegedly unknown.
Yes, we are aware of the problem. Added feature request:
https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-1
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
2. Please show the plan or status name somewhere in the title area (not only in the Cloud Storage menu).
Sounds good. Added feature request:
https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-2
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
3. With "Save State" the current name of the plan should be suggested (then it can be supplemented more easily with a version number).
Do you mean to create a name suggestion based on the location that you are flying at? I added that here:
https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-3
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
4. For the desktop version, the panels on the right and left side of the map could be daintier and smaller in size (more space on the map and the panels do not need to be extra expanded - faster work).
The desktop design is done by professional UI / UX designers, we trust them but we will gladly forward your feedback to them.
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
5. Corrections in the number fields should also be saved with "Enter" instead of additionally clicking on "Save" (faster work).
Yes: https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-4
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
6. If several selected waypoints are deselected by clicking on the map, the display of all waypoints disappears (only the contour of the trajectory is visible). It must be clicked on for further processing, first the contour and then the now to be edited waypoint - a bit awkward.
So if I understand correctly, you would rather have the contour still active after the deselection of the waypoints?
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
7. "Set Gimbal" displays partially five-digit numbers. Only when you adjust the slider, the usual degrees appear.
Yes: https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-5
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
8. In "Set Gimbal", the degree display does not change when "Direct at POI" is requested.
Yes: https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-6
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
9. The display of "Rotate" always automatically returns to zero after changes.
Currently, the tool works as a relative delta to the original angle. So after executing a change, the delta is back to 0 and you have an updated angle. I included both aspects:
https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-7
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
10. It might be helpful to initiate editing the waypoints by right-clicking.
Yes, right clicking in general to open a context menu is planned.
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
11. When the 3D-view is selected, it is first cropped sideways - it must first be zoomed out to see the entire trajectory.
Yes: https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-8
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
12. It would be helpful if in the 3D view the line of sight of the camera is indicated by a line up to the POI (as in the mobile app).
https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-9
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
13. It would be a good time now to implement the specification for a specific airspeed between individual waypoints (important, for example, for the approach to the first photo and from the last image to the landing position).
Long time existing feature request (did not have yet time for it): https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHPLANNER-I-48
Apart from UI changes also has implications on a lot of behind the scenes "logic", but is doable.
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
14. I'm just an amateur pilot. But if I had a company and used DH professionally, I would be very worried about storing all the data in the cloud.
I have not found any clues as to whether the transfer of data to the cloud is encrypted end-to-end.
I have not found any clues as to whether the business data is encrypted in the cloud and if it is only viewable by the user.
Rather, the Privacy Policy suggests that all steps of DH users are tracked and logged in detail. That worries me even as a private user!
We strongly believe that the user should be always in control if he wants to share PII ('Personally identifiable information) data with the cloud. That's why the user can always turn on/off the cloud synchronization. We will keep this approach to data privacy also for the future. Anonymized use of the application we track and log in order to understand how our application is used. This will help us improve the application, by looking at the statistical use of our products. For example, if a certain flight plan or parameter is never used, it is probably a good idea to ask ourselves why or even if that should be removed. The Privacy policy lists how we protect your information (currently Section 3). Common industry standards (encryption) are part of these protection efforts.
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
15. For this reason, you should offer in the program settings to secure the status either locally, encrypted in the cloud or in both places.
We offer enabling / disabling of cloud synchronization of PII.
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
16. It is not yet clear how the synchronization between the cloud and the mobile device should take place when e.g. on the mobile device changes are made and no network is available for synchronization. How is the treatment of possible version conflicts?
Synchronization will be triggered at different places, so once you will go online again at some point the synchronization is triggered again. Version conflicts are generally resolved using time stamps. Version management in such asynchronous / multi-client environments has so many aspects to it, that we do not explain to you here how we handle every situation.
Cuspis wrote:
Fri May 03, 2019 11:08 pm
17. Presumably, a new pdf user guide will be launched soon. It would be helpful if date and version no. could be noted on the title page or in the file name.
Yes, a user guide update is in the works. I will forward your request to our pdf editor :-)!

Martin
Posts: 194
Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:47 pm

Re: DH Web-Interface - first impressions

Post by Martin » Thu May 09, 2019 12:18 pm

Thanks for the feedback!
JasonBSteele wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 1:56 pm
2. The "hit area" for selecting a way point is very small. I was using a trackpad rather than a mouse but even so you have to be pointing at about one of 4 pixels to select it!
The hit area is always a trade-off: Too big, and it becomes difficult to select the right thing when there are other things in close proximity. Too little, and hard to hit. Zooming in helps of course, but we likely will increase it a bit. And I will forward your feedback to the devs!
JasonBSteele wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 1:56 pm
3. I find having to unselect a way point before selecting another one cumbersome, I frequently forget and end up updating both way points instead of one.
4. I would rather use the shift key to select all the way points between the last selected and the current one, and ctrl key to select individual ones. This makes selecting multiple way points easier, especially when we don't have the lasso yet!
Yes: https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-10


The other things I already included in my answer above.

Martin
Posts: 194
Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2018 4:47 pm

Re: DH Web-Interface - first impressions

Post by Martin » Thu May 09, 2019 12:20 pm

JasonBSteele wrote:
Mon May 06, 2019 6:41 pm
Cuspis wrote:
Mon May 06, 2019 12:58 pm
The suggestion # 1. is a bit dangerous if you change your mind in between and still want to leave everything as it was.
The immediate acceptance of the values does not quite correspond to the usual procedure for the operation of programs. But at least you could still save yourself with the "UNDO" -function.
I would say that the immediate acceptance of values is becoming more common. If you look at Chrome settings for example there are no Save buttons.
If you find yourself entering a value when you didn't intend to the Escape key sometimes works to revert.

Thanks
Both behaviors have their place depending on what kind of form and content is edited. We will include it in our considerations.

Cuspis
Posts: 21
Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:23 pm
Location: Germany

Re: DH Web-Interface - first impressions

Post by Cuspis » Thu May 09, 2019 9:56 pm

@Martin: Thank you for your detailed answers

I purposely chosed this forum for my comments because here the issues can be discussed and explained more comfortable from all participiants.

I am pleased that the proposals ## 1, 2, 5, 7, 8, 10, 11, 12 and 17 have been estimated to be useful and have found your approval.


Cuspis wrote: ↑
Sat May 04, 2019 1:08 am
3. With "Save State" the current name of the plan should be suggested (then it can be supplemented more easily with a version number).

Martin wrote:
Do you mean to create a name suggestion based on the location that you are flying at? I added that here:
https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-3
Example of a workflow, as it usually happens to me:
When I'm planning the film sequence of the St. Martin Church in Dinkelsdorf, I call the corresponding flight plan, for example, "dinkelsdorf-st-martin-A001" and enter there only the obstacles.
In "dinkelsdorf-st-martin-A002" I enter the main waypoints. Then the trajectory is smoothed, for example with 44 waypoints and the curvature 2. It is then stored under "dinkelsdorf-st-martin-A003-44-2".
For an even rounder trajectory, the plan "dinkelsdorf-st-martin-A002" is reloaded and smoothed with 80 waypoints and curvature 7, for example. It will then be saved under "dinkelsdorf-st-martin-A003-80-7".
If I do not like the trajectory, I can fall back on the plan "dinkelsdorf-st-martin-A001" and choose a whole new trajectory, which would then be saved under "dinkelsdorf-st-martin-B002".
It can therefore be seen that the basic framework in the name of the flight plan ("dinkelsdorf-st-martin-A00x") is always the same and should accordingly also be proposed when saving again. Then only small changes of the name need to be done.
This also has the advantage that all plans for a particular object can be archived in a logical order.

But if the plans later on suddenly are sorted once by date and not by filename (as it now happens in the app 1.10), the nice order is lost again. :-(


Cuspis wrote: ↑
Sat May 04, 2019 1:08 am
4. For the desktop version, the panels on the right and left side of the map could be daintier and smaller in size (more space on the map and the panels do not need to be extra expanded - faster work).

Martin wrote:
The desktop design is done by professional UI / UX designers, we trust them but we will gladly forward your feedback to them.
The side bars use approximately 30 % of my screen and the letters have a size of approx. 14 pt. On the other hand there is not enough place to keep all menues open and additional mouseclicking is necessary. I am convinced your UI designers are as professional as to be able to create a even more user friendly surface in the next versions.


Cuspis wrote: ↑
Sat May 04, 2019 1:08 am
6. If several selected waypoints are deselected by clicking on the map, the display of all waypoints disappears (only the contour of the trajectory is visible). It must be clicked on for further processing, first the contour and then the now to be edited waypoint - a bit awkward.

Martin wrote:
So if I understand correctly, you would rather have the contour still active after the deselection of the waypoints?
No. The behavior should remain as in the app. All waypoints are always visible. If a waypoint is selected, the handles for rotation, positioning and the angle of view is visible. By clicking on the map again, the normal order of waypoints will be visible as before. In the web interface, however, all waypoints disappear and only the contour of the trajectory is visible, which is not really helpful.


Cuspis wrote: ↑
Sat May 04, 2019 1:08 am
9. The display of "Rotate" always automatically returns to zero after changes.

Martin wrote:
Currently, the tool works as a relative delta to the original angle. So after executing a change, the delta is back to 0 and you have an updated angle. I included both aspects:
https://ideas.droneharmony.com/ideas/DHCLOUD-I-7
Important ist the real angle (e.g. East = 90°). A compass like display can be a nice but not very essential extra benefit. The "relative delta to the original angle" can be kept anyway for easier transformations of 45/90/.../180/270 degrees without mental arithmetic.


Cuspis wrote: ↑
Sat May 04, 2019 1:08 am
14. I'm just an amateur pilot. But if I had a company and used DH professionally, I would be very worried about storing all the data in the cloud.
I have not found any clues as to whether the transfer of data to the cloud is encrypted end-to-end.
I have not found any clues as to whether the business data is encrypted in the cloud and if it is only viewable by the user.
Rather, the Privacy Policy suggests that all steps of DH users are tracked and logged in detail. That worries me even as a private user!

Martin wrote:
We strongly believe that the user should be always in control if he wants to share PII ('Personally identifiable information) data with the cloud. That's why the user can always turn on/off the cloud synchronization. We will keep this approach to data privacy also for the future. Anonymized use of the application we track and log in order to understand how our application is used. This will help us improve the application, by looking at the statistical use of our products. For example, if a certain flight plan or parameter is never used, it is probably a good idea to ask ourselves why or even if that should be removed. The Privacy policy lists how we protect your information (currently Section 3). Common industry standards (encryption) are part of these protection efforts.

Cuspis wrote: ↑
Sat May 04, 2019 1:08 am
15. For this reason, you should offer in the program settings to secure the status either locally, encrypted in the cloud or in both places.

Martin wrote:
We offer enabling / disabling of cloud synchronization of PII.

Cuspis wrote: ↑
Sat May 04, 2019 1:08 am
16. It is not yet clear how the synchronization between the cloud and the mobile device should take place when e.g. on the mobile device changes are made and no network is available for synchronization. How is the treatment of possible version conflicts?

Martin wrote:
Synchronization will be triggered at different places, so once you will go online again at some point the synchronization is triggered again. Version conflicts are generally resolved using time stamps. Version management in such asynchronous / multi-client environments has so many aspects to it, that we do not explain to you here how we handle every situation.

I have read your arguments, but I do only agree with a very small part of it. Because of the complexity of this topic I do not want to deepen it now and here.
But if I were a corporate customer with confidential job data, I would have a big problem at this point. Maybe one of your corporate clients can explain that to you in a better and more convincing way than me.

I still do not see the option to save a web-edited flight plan in the same way as any other file on my PC locally in a certain directory (without using a cloud!).
From this directory on my PC I would like to transfer individual flight plans to my mobile phone connected to the DJI remote control if necessary (also without the use of a cloud!)
The app on my phone should be able to execute this plan without using the cloud.

How does that work at Drone Harmony?
These are very elementary things that you can do with any photo or any other file. I can transfer photos from my phone to my PC and I can send pictures from my PC to my phone without having to use a cloud.
I would like to achieve that with the DH flight plans in the same way!

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